Exhaust Mod?

Oldscoot

New member
Since the Akropovic has an official BMW part number and is EPA-certified as legal in the US, I seriously doubt you'd void your warranty if THAT were the exhaust you installed. You're on your own with anything else, though.



Jaime - Have you, or anyone else, gotten something in writing from a BMW dealer that installing an Akropovic exhaust purchased through BMW by the BMW dealer would not void the warranty? While the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act regulates warranties and protects the consumer there may be specific terms or conditions stated in a warranty which may result in its being voided. I've not read the warranty language that came with my C600 but I've seen language in other bike warranties that tampering with or removing the exhaust voids the warranty. I'm not sure how Harley handles that because most of their brand new bikes end up with aftermarket pipes.
 

JaimeC

New member
All warranty language cautions against non-OEM parts. If the Akropovic is in the BMW accessories catalog (it is), and is part of the BMW distribution system (having a BMW part number confirms this), then it is not a non-OEM part and is therefore covered.

Unless they've changed their policy, if you order the bike WITH the exhaust installed, it is also covered by the original 3-year, 36,000 mile warranty too.

If you have it installed afterward, it is only covered by the standard "new parts" warranty (which I think is only a year).
 

Doraemon

New member
by the testing we did on the dyno, the open exhaust (no cat) is on the take off first 1000rpm, I think it is in the photos on my gallery...
 

skazuz

New member
Jaime - Have you, or anyone else, gotten something in writing from a BMW dealer that installing an Akropovic exhaust purchased through BMW by the BMW dealer would not void the warranty? While the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act regulates warranties and protects the consumer there may be specific terms or conditions stated in a warranty which may result in its being voided. I've not read the warranty language that came with my C600 but I've seen language in other bike warranties that tampering with or removing the exhaust voids the warranty. I'm not sure how Harley handles that because most of their brand new bikes end up with aftermarket pipes.

So far in Singapore you can fix anything as long as you don't tamper with the engine & transmission. The dealers are ok with it.

But make sure you pay the dealer to fix the after market exhaust. If not refer will void if you do it on your own.

Cheers


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Doraemon

New member
So far in Singapore you can fix anything as long as you don't tamper with the engine & transmission. The dealers are ok with it.

But make sure you pay the dealer to fix the after market exhaust. If not refer will void if you do it on your own.

Cheers


Any good items at motoworld? I coming in April and plan on going there and the shops over by mustafa, after getting my Roti and Teh Tarik of course!!
Are the BMW's still on Bukit Timah; I used to live across the street at the sterling. Wish I would have had the c600 over there instead of my FZ6.
 

SteveADV

Active member
Doraemon.....From now on, when someone chimes in from a place you have NOT been, please let us know. :D

You live that James Bond global life and if I sound jealous, well I am, of course.

As for me, next week Pittsburgh followed by St. Louis the week after. Not exactly the same as your typical travel itinerary but good beer and good folks in both of those towns.
 

Doraemon

New member
Doraemon.....From now on, when someone chimes in from a place you have NOT been, please let us know. :D

You live that James Bond global life and if I sound jealous, well I am, of course.

As for me, next week Pittsburgh followed by St. Louis the week after. Not exactly the same as your typical travel itinerary but good beer and good folks in both of those towns.

Well, I'm in New York this week. come on up to White plains and I'll show what sort of work takes you around the world. he he

By the way, when my last pasport number was XXX007XXX and my first name was James I did get know in a few places as James Bond.
 

skazuz

New member
Any good items at motoworld? I coming in April and plan on going there and the shops over by mustafa, after getting my Roti and Teh Tarik of course!!
Are the BMW's still on Bukit Timah; I used to live across the street at the sterling. Wish I would have had the c600 over there instead of my FZ6.

Doraemon - they have moved to Alexandra just beside the ikea..

I don't fancy motoworld. Sorry.


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Doraemon

New member
Doraemon - they have moved to Alexandra just beside the ikea..

I don't fancy motoworld. Sorry.


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thanks good to know, When living there I only bought maybe 1-2 items to adapt to my FZ6 that I had there. Most was just for CB400's since there seems to be hundreds of them.
 

omniphil

Member
Just wanted to see if Doraemon had any updates on gas mileage? I had a bike that I added a power commander to, the place that dyno tuned it for me also removed the 02 sensor. The downside was the gas mileage dropped about 10mpg. That's not something I would want ;)
 

Skutorr

Active member
You have to keep in mind that it is all an interconnected/interdependent system; engine design, intake design, exhaust design. With a short stroke engine like the C-series, the "sweet sport' as far as overall efficiency (mileage) is where the common area is maximized, in graphical form, under both the horsepower and torque curves.

Street engine design is COMPLETELY different than Racing engine design. Your entire intake track, from velocity stacks, through the throttle bodies/injectors, though the valves in the head (controlled by the specific cam lift/duration/overlap/ramp profile) out through the downpipes, through the cat and past the muffler, is all a compromise balanced design.

It's even MORE critical on a CVT design, as you cannot change gears to stay in any particular rpm band; it's preset by the CVT assembly. If you change any major link in that chain (exhaust system, cams, variator, throttle bodies, etc.) it usually impacts another area negatively. One reason that the C-series are doggy off of the line is where the engagement design point was set for the clutch, to attempt to maximize in-city mileage for quoted comparison. The problem is, this engine was NEVER designed with a lower-rpm torque peak; it's all higher rpm, both torque and horsepower.

So, you change -out the entire exhaust system, head-back. Now you've radically increased initial exhaust port scavenging in the downpipes, but may have completely lost the ram-tuning effect of a TUNED exhaust system, where the internal volume is a multiple of the exhaust charge fraction. You are louder, feel cooler, actually go slower, run leaner and hotter, and your mileage decreases.

This is what almost every home-bred Tmax Tuner does in Europe. Oh, it SOUNDS NICE! RACIER! And it now is DEAD off the line, because they lost the major portion of the engine torque at lower rpms. So, on goes the J-Costa Evo4 or screaming Mallossi to get the rpms up to where there actually is some power....and it runs even leaner. So, on with the Power Commander to richen it up. THERE! Much better and actually faster than stock! But wait, now it's running at 7,000 rpm all the time and mileage has dropped by 30%!!!

And you end-up with a Pseudo Race-bike that really isn't, and is now a PAIN to ride on the street...

My brother wanted a cooler exhaust on his Tmax 500, so he got a Yoshimura R-77 out of LA ("Race Use Only") and on it went. Wow, from 80Db to 96? That's a bit loud. Off the line? An absolute PIG. Lost ALL it's lower end, or, as they say in all the Spanish Tmax forums "he perdido todo de bajos!". It was SUCH a larger-bore race system that it lost all the necessary back pressure to flow through the head correctly. We modified the removable Db killer to a smaller diameter, and got back 80% of the losses. $500 and a shitload of work later, and he had an annoyingly loud, slower bike...but SHINEY, SHINEY!!

Ah, but there ARE options to keep an eye out for! After he got his 2012 530, he tried to swap-out the Yoshi onto the new bike. O2 sensor interfered with the new rear suspension design. CRAP! Now what? I'm tired of Tmax stock Water Heater Exhausts!

He found the MIVV "Stronger" system, which just came out for the Tmax. They claimed power/torque increases ACROSS the BOARD. Right.

Got it in, put it on. Paired downpipes a TICK larger than stock, but with a Crossover??? A long system, running through a partially baffled muffler and out through a DB killer assembly the SAME DIAMETER as stock? Looks like a LOT of engineering went into this! but how does it WORK?

The nice, rumblier sound measured-out at 84Db vs the stock measured 81. Close enough! Off the line, where before his stock 530 and my modified 500 were dead even, he now just WALKED AWAY! Whaaat? At speed, punching it side-by-side, where we had been even before, he again WALKED AWAY. Holy CRAP. Ah, but I bet his mileage changed!

Yep, it did. On our Sierras trip, he averaged 8-10% BETTER mileage that he had before with the stock system. So what happened? The MIVV engineers designed the system to maximize every aspect of performance of a STOCK bike. NO ONE ELSE does that; it's all Ricky Racer Mods, which are MUCH cheaper to engineer. Just make the pipes BIGGER and LOUDER.

My advice? HOUND MIVV to add a "Stronger" system for the C-series bikes. Everything else is just opening-up a can of worms...
 

JaimeC

New member
This isn't "the good ol' days" where slapping on an exhaust was all you needed for performance (maybe a jet kit). EVERYTHING is designed from top to bottom to work together as a system. These systems are designed by engineers FAR FAR smarter than most of us could ever dream, and they have access to computer systems far more advanced than ours. All of that work goes into designing our STREET VEHICLES to get the best possible performance without sacrificing reliability or economy. Any attempt on our part if far more likely to completely screw things up than to make them better. If you want better performance, look into the variator updates Sku-Torr recommended. If all you want to do is make noise, buy a better horn.
 

omniphil

Member
I will disagree with some of this.. The engineers are way smarter than me, yes. However they have to design things while paying attention to emissions, noise and other regulations. Once you start adding parts on your own you can make things better most of the time without having to worry about those things. My car while not the same engine design picked quite a bit of power from removing the cat for example.

Manufactures have to hold back some power in the name of regulations. Most of the time you can unlock a little more, I think that's what we are after here..
http://www.arrow.it/miniaturaMod.aspx?src=oggetti/4787_GRH_BMW_C600Sport_12-13.jpg&w=700&max=700
 

Doraemon

New member
Just wanted to see if Doraemon had any updates on gas mileage? I had a bike that I added a power commander to, the place that dyno tuned it for me also removed the 02 sensor. The downside was the gas mileage dropped about 10mpg. That's not something I would want ;)
I'm using Fuelly.com to track. due to my business travel and terrain that I drive on I am getting 36 avg. but on days I drive nice (not angry) I get closer to 40+
 

Doraemon

New member
This isn't "the good ol' days" where slapping on an exhaust was all you needed for performance (maybe a jet kit). EVERYTHING is designed from top to bottom to work together as a system. These systems are designed by engineers FAR FAR smarter than most of us could ever dream, and they have access to computer systems far more advanced than ours. All of that work goes into designing our STREET VEHICLES to get the best possible performance without sacrificing reliability or economy. Any attempt on our part if far more likely to completely screw things up than to make them better. If you want better performance, look into the variator updates Sku-Torr recommended. If all you want to do is make noise, buy a better horn.


On the dyno with Apoc we ran a test with baffle and without. the only difference it made was on take off. louder let more air thru in the initial power on state. after 3000 or so the power equaled out. it should be in the gallery with all my other dyno charts.
 

Skutorr

Active member
If all you want to do is make noise, buy a better horn.

Couldn't have said it better. And, by the way, if you want to ride Big Sur again, or anytime, YOU CAN"T. :confused:
Insanely annoying loud exhausts on cruising Harleys have led to the banning of ALL two-wheeled vehicles on Highway 1.

Thanks, guys. Classy move...:mad:
 

coyok

New member
Hi guys,
Just asking views on the GPR exhaust which was on my previous bike that I kept it before the bike was trade-in for my new C600. My idea is to put that GPR exhaust on C600. Will this work out with some modification? FYI, here at my place got few workshops which are quite good at exhaust-mod and they are the one who some riders are after for because they want to save some bucks rather then spending a bit on popular brands. Most of the workmanship are good with remarkable performance i.e. no power loss, reliable but with no brand. All these drive me ideas to put that GPR on with the cat removed and replaced by straight-thru stainless aluminum pipe. Need advices before I get those ideas done soon. Thanks
 

Snowdog

New member
I want a muffler quieter then any muffler should be allowed to be. Then I want a massage seat, a drink holder with cooling system, and an electric center stand. Then! I would have a high performance SPORT!!!!
 

grey.hound

New member
Is there any real difference between the slip on exhausts? They vary in price by a couple hundred or so, depending on the model and vendor. I am not really worried about performance, but would like something more attractive and with a nice sound. Oh, and quality. Titanium, Stainless, which is best for longevity. Some say things like aluminum with titanium coating or carbon coating. I know that's a whole different can of worms, but I'd hate to spend money on something that in 2 years is going to look like crap.

Akrapovi?

BMW scooter exhausts | GPR Motorcycle Exhausts

Arrow Special Parts

Exhausts BMW - C 600 SPORT - - MIVV

http://scooterpartsco.com/bmw-scoot...-slip-on-exhaust-for-bmw-600-scooter-m3215629
 
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