Skutorr
Active member
Uh, it's the second worst. Check out the worst and best...
Is Harley-Davidson the Worst Motorcycle Money Can Buy? (HOG)
Is Harley-Davidson the Worst Motorcycle Money Can Buy? (HOG)
Is Harley-Davidson the WORST motorcycle money can buy??
- Thread starter Skutorr
- Start date
FloridianRobert
New member
I can't say I'm that surprised by this. My 650GT has 5,600 miles and still has that classic oil staining on the rear castings that the dealer can't explain. While the BMW simply is a better ride, the Burgman was so solid even at the 40,000 mile mark. I fear for what is to come at 40,000 on the 650. I try to enjoy my bike and not cry over things, but this just spoke to me about the quality issues that has beset BMW recently. For 11K, this bike shouldn't leak. I am pretty serious about selling this bike and going back to something more service friendly and frankly more dependable.
I enjoy your posts!
Oldscoot
New member
It makes sense. A smaller, simpler Japanese bike is going to have fewer problems than a larger, more complicated bike. But it is also going to be less fun to ride. You pay your dollar - you take your chance.
Yamaha is my favorite brand of all time. I had great fun on my Yamahas back in the day.
Yamaha is my favorite brand of all time. I had great fun on my Yamahas back in the day.
JaimeC
New member
As much as I love Yamahas, the dealer support around here SUCKS. I may have problems with my C650GT, but the dealer support is WONDERFUL. That makes all the difference to me.
And at 180,000 miles, my K1200LT has been one of the most reliable VEHICLES (two OR four wheels) that I've ever owned. I wonder how many Harleys are running around with that kind of mileage?
And at 180,000 miles, my K1200LT has been one of the most reliable VEHICLES (two OR four wheels) that I've ever owned. I wonder how many Harleys are running around with that kind of mileage?
FloridianRobert
New member
My guess would be none. Part of the problem in Tampa is the dealer network sucks. These BMW scoots are seemingly an annoyance to the BMW motorcycle dealerships in this area. There is a dealer in Sarasota (50 miles south) that I am going to try to see if I get some better results.
I had a Majesty and it was an amazing machine. I sure miss that bike, but 400cc just wasn't enough anymore. I don't know why they haven't stepped out with something bigger....
JaimeC
New member
When I was in Las Vegas last week, I was talking to the guy at Eagle Rider/BMW (I rented a K1600GTL to use for the week). He had quite a few C650GT and C600 Sports on the floor. He said when they first came out, everyone at the dealership was excited about them, but the reality has been that they can't GIVE them away. On the other hand, the various GS models sell out early in the year. In New York where I live, the C600 Sport models would sit for a few weeks, but the C650GT models would sell as soon as they hit the floor.
As for Las Vegas, the scooters are still popular amongst the staff as "loaner" vehicles but they haven't figured out how to sell them to the buying public. I guess with all the desert, I can understand the popularity of the GS bikes. "The Strip" isn't all that big, and the other roads aren't nearly as congested.
As for Las Vegas, the scooters are still popular amongst the staff as "loaner" vehicles but they haven't figured out how to sell them to the buying public. I guess with all the desert, I can understand the popularity of the GS bikes. "The Strip" isn't all that big, and the other roads aren't nearly as congested.
FloridianRobert
New member
The dealership in Tampa has stopped carrying them all together. He does have one used one, 2013 650GT with 2,800 miles for $8,850.00. Beyond that, they just don't seem to like the line at all. It really puts me in a bind because it's now either Orlando (which is a death trap), or Sarasota. Their dealer is an "all-around" dealer that carries Yamaha, BMW, Honda, Harley, and Triumph. I'm going down there for the 6,000 mile service to see what it's all about. It amazes me that there is such a negative mentality to these scoots in the US.
Thanks for the good feedback.
Oldscoot
New member
Keep in mind that the last Yamaha T-Max imported to the U.S. was in 2010. There are still 2009 T-Max bikes (my favorite black and yellow bikes) sitting on the floor in dealerships. They are incredible bikes and in Europe they fly out the dealer's door and BMWs sell well too.
We are pioneers.
I honestly believe that my C600 ranks among the top bikes I have ever owned and suits my purposes better than anything else out there.
We are pioneers.
I honestly believe that my C600 ranks among the top bikes I have ever owned and suits my purposes better than anything else out there.
Oldscoot
New member
Actually, they stopped importing TMAXes after the 2011 model year. 2012 is when Yamaha introduced the 530cc version with the belt drive which we never got to see in the States.
You are correct. Now I remember that Yamaha skipped importing 2010 models. I had a 2010 ordered that was cancelled. But - now I have the C600 and I couldn't be more pleased.
dascooter
New member
Man, I hate to see these comments. I get myself all set to go order a 650 and I see a post about reliability or dealers not sticking with the BMW scooter line. I agree with the comments about reliability and having the scooter that's the most exciting to ride. Since it would not be my primary mode of transportation (car still would be), I can live with that. But not knowing that the 1 local dealer in St. Louis would continue to support it does have me concerned.
The other option seems to be the Burgman. Pretty rock solid scooter and plenty of dealer support pretty much anywhere you go. Just does not excite me as much as the BMW. Haven't ridden either yet and I know some of it is the BMW badge vs the Suzuki. But since I won't change bikes often I want my next one to be one I can hang on to a long time.
Any current BMW owners that came from a Burgamn who can comment on which one they would buy today if they had to get another? Appreciate any input as warm weather has to be here soon and that's when I want to have the new scooter.
The other option seems to be the Burgman. Pretty rock solid scooter and plenty of dealer support pretty much anywhere you go. Just does not excite me as much as the BMW. Haven't ridden either yet and I know some of it is the BMW badge vs the Suzuki. But since I won't change bikes often I want my next one to be one I can hang on to a long time.
Any current BMW owners that came from a Burgamn who can comment on which one they would buy today if they had to get another? Appreciate any input as warm weather has to be here soon and that's when I want to have the new scooter.
justscootin
Member
The TMax is still here in Canada. You can get a 2013 or 2014.
JaimeC
New member
I guess the rumors that they weren't going to import them after 2013 were false then. Lucky you.
justscootin
Member
I guess the rumors that they weren't going to import them after 2013 were false then. Lucky you.
I am not in the market for a scooter now
Oldscoot
New member
It almost hit 80 here today. I'm certainly not willing to move to Canada to buy a T-Max.
I remain 100% happy with my BMW. A good bike with a good dealership equals happiness. A good bike with a bad dealership, or perhaps a bad bike with a good dealership equals discontent.
I remain 100% happy with my BMW. A good bike with a good dealership equals happiness. A good bike with a bad dealership, or perhaps a bad bike with a good dealership equals discontent.
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JaimeC
New member
One of the reasons I got rid of the TMAX was that it wasn't as practical as the C650GT. Much less luggage capacity, no ABS brakes, LOUD wind buffeting off the windshield, and no locking glove box. Combine that with the lousy service I was getting from the local Yamaha dealers and it was no contest. It WAS fun to ride... but then so is the C650GT!
I love to fool around with Harley guys, like coming up behind them and listening to the noise get louder and louder as they try to pick up speed then blow past them. Then if you happen to see them at a light later in the day they will not even look over at you.
I have owned 2 Bergman's and one Yamaha. Bergman's trouble free for 37K, liked the Yamaha 1300AE but it did not like me. Service on both were great. The 650GT is another story the local dealer could not hit his rear end with either hand so I travel 120 miles for service and he is great. Middle son has a 1000 RR and the local guy could not upgrade the software or change a rear tire without BMW help so you see why I do not go there. The local dealer is a Harley dealer primarily so enough said.
I have owned 2 Bergman's and one Yamaha. Bergman's trouble free for 37K, liked the Yamaha 1300AE but it did not like me. Service on both were great. The 650GT is another story the local dealer could not hit his rear end with either hand so I travel 120 miles for service and he is great. Middle son has a 1000 RR and the local guy could not upgrade the software or change a rear tire without BMW help so you see why I do not go there. The local dealer is a Harley dealer primarily so enough said.
Skutorr
Active member
Actually, they stopped importing TMAXes after the 2011 model year. 2012 is when Yamaha introduced the 530cc version with the belt drive which we never got to see in the States.
Jaime:
Right now, in Hamilton Ontario at a 5-Star Yamaha Dealer, the low-mileage 2012 Tmax 530 that my brother has purchased is having a MPH dash from England installed to replace the KPH one. it will then be 50-state NHTSA and California compliant for safety and emissions; funds and title are in escrow, and the import broker is having the transporter pick it up next week. Should arrive at my brother's house in San Diego in about two weeks.
Tmax 530. In the US. Total cost is less than $8,500.00.
This is going to be FUN!
JaimeC
New member
The basic problem with "Gray Market Imports" like that are the fact that the US-based dealerships are probably NOT going to be able to provide you any service or support. Your brother is pretty much going to be on his own. If he's handy in the shop, that's not an issue but for someone like me, that's a deal-breaker.
FloridianRobert
New member
The scooter is amazing conceptually. Certainly, there have been issues with this product line. My only personal issue is continued leakage at the rear which the dealer seems to be unable to resolve. I check fluids and wipe it clean every so often as I keep my bike in immaculate shape. You will certainly find other issues as you peruse these boards including several people that had such issues requiring a hard fought replacement of the bike itself. I have owned about every scoot produced with exception to a Kymco unit. The Honda Silver Wing is a bike that I always felt like an accessory on. In other words, you don't ride with it, you ride on it. It was not a personal favorite and I was glad to have traded it off. The Yamaha Majesty was amazing, but at 400cc I grew tired of it as it was underpowered for long distance riding. Sure, you can add different rollers and such, but it is what it is, a 400 cc scooter superior in that class. This brings me to the Burgman. I owned a 650 and it was a great bike. Easy to self service with the help of LeDude and his superior self help videos for repairing ANYTHING that is Burgman. Additionally, you have a plethora of dealerships to utilize for service beyond what you are able to do yourself. With the BMW, to keep the great warranty, you simply have to utilize a small pool of dealers. In metropolitan areas, this can be 2-3 but for others, the closest dealer can literally be hundreds of miles away. If I had no scooter today and a pocket full of money, I would choose the C650GT over the Burgman. What I will caution you about is this, investigate your local BMW dealership. In Tampa, I have not had a warm and fuzzy feeling as part of the BMW family. JaimeC, on the other hand is in NY state and has reported that the dealers there are great to deal with and knowledgeable about the product. Again, in Tampa they came out with fanfare, but quickly dropped the line for sales. And, you just know when you show up for service that they would rather be anywhere but servicing your scooter.
It sounds to me like you have made your personal choice of the BMW over the Burgman. IMHO, I would really dig into the dealerships in your area and TALK to them and others about service reputation. See if they are knowledgeable on service and more importantly enthusiastic about this line. If you get a good feeling, pull the trigger and buy what you want. If not, I would personally reconsider going to a Burgman. I say this simply because I am not mechanically inclined and in Florida, there are only dealers in the large cities. You may have more options that I have being on a peninsular state?
Nonetheless, if you have specific questions I would be happy to answer them as I have owned both. I do not regret my purchase, rather I regret that the dealer in Tampa could care less about these scooters anymore. I hope to have more success by taking it to Sarasota. If this doesn't work, I'll have to persuade LeDude to buy a BMW and start a video collection. If you are lost on the reference to LeDude, he has a s#!t-ton of YouTube videos on every major (and minor) facet of doing your own service. He is a godsend to ANY Burgman owner. With BMW, we can't seem to get the friggin service manual in English.....
Good luck!
It sounds to me like you have made your personal choice of the BMW over the Burgman. IMHO, I would really dig into the dealerships in your area and TALK to them and others about service reputation. See if they are knowledgeable on service and more importantly enthusiastic about this line. If you get a good feeling, pull the trigger and buy what you want. If not, I would personally reconsider going to a Burgman. I say this simply because I am not mechanically inclined and in Florida, there are only dealers in the large cities. You may have more options that I have being on a peninsular state?
Nonetheless, if you have specific questions I would be happy to answer them as I have owned both. I do not regret my purchase, rather I regret that the dealer in Tampa could care less about these scooters anymore. I hope to have more success by taking it to Sarasota. If this doesn't work, I'll have to persuade LeDude to buy a BMW and start a video collection. If you are lost on the reference to LeDude, he has a s#!t-ton of YouTube videos on every major (and minor) facet of doing your own service. He is a godsend to ANY Burgman owner. With BMW, we can't seem to get the friggin service manual in English.....
Good luck!